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A nasty shower – Lega Nord

Berlusconi’s manifest silliness has concealed one of the more unpleasant by-products of his victory in the Italian elections. The Lega Nord’s leader Umberto Bossi has steered his party to a major electoral breakthrough – in fact he has even described his proto-fascist ragbag as the “new workers’ party” following the collapse of the “Rainbow Left”…

Liam
2–4 minutes

Indiano riserve immigrazione elett08 Berlusconi’s manifest silliness has concealed one of the more unpleasant by-products of his victory in the Italian elections. The Lega Nord’s leader Umberto Bossi has steered his party to a major electoral breakthrough – in fact he has even described his proto-fascist ragbag as the “new workers’ party” following the collapse of the “Rainbow Left” (Sinistra Arcobaleno).

As Lidia Cirillo, a leader of Sinistra Critica points out in her interview the the Swiss website A l’encontre the Lega Nord scored votes in excess of 25% in traditionally left-leaning northern Italian regions such as Lombardy and Piedmont as well as in its own strongholds. These are areas with a lot of medium and large scale industry. The aggressively regionalist party now has 23 senators and 46 MPs and scored just over 8% of the national vote.

This is indicative of just how disorganised the Italian workers’ movement has become. Berlusconi now has five years with a coalition that by Italian standard is miraculously stable. He won’t have to do the horse trading with the eccentric fringe parties which the Economist complained prevented him from being as energetically neo-liberal as Prodi. This gives him the freedom to go on the offensive and the fact that even the CGIL, the former Communist union federation, has major numbers of members who voted for Bossi will give him still more scope.

NO al voto agli immigrati elett08 Lidia points out that Berlusconi’s coalition now has an openly racist party in government. She’s not wrong either. The front page of its website carries a story about how it plans to issue women with a protective spray. Good feminist stuff? Not really. It’s to protect them against attack from ” Romanians and other foreigners”. One of their MPs Paolo Grimoldi is coming out with rhetoric that not even the BNP uses here. An example from the same story has him talking about “cleaning up and getting rid of the gypsy camps”. This is his description of the shanty towns in which migrant workers live. Their website has the slogan “no votes for immigrants” and in one weird image has a picture of a native American with the caption “he suffered from immigration”. If memory serves a lot of that would have been Italians but to be fair they never earned a reputation for criminal activity in the United States.

The social base of the Lega Nord has been the small employers and owners of family size businesses. Now it has attracted a section of white collar workers and industrial workers. Pietro Basso points out in the interview in A l’encontre that Bossi was determined to rub salt in Bertinotti’s wounds by saying that “the proletariat is with us” and adding that “at least he new that Rifondazione’s old general secretary was a worker even if he and his party didn’t have any seats in parliament.”

Resentment against the amount of state money that was spent in the south was the Lega Nord’s old song. Its new tune is a racist anti-immigrant discourse that is shocking to those of us who don’t read the Daily Mail. Trite though it may sound it’s pretty obvious that the failure of the “soft left” and the abandonment of a perspective of class struggle has thrown a lot of Italian workers into its arms. There may not be much that we can do about that here but at least we should try to make sure that wherever the racist Lega sends its ministers outside Italy that they are made to feel unwelcome.

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25 responses to “A nasty shower – Lega Nord”

  1. Hermes Avatar
    Hermes

    The Italian people have made a democratic expression. What is so shocking and wrong with that? If the Left was more loyal to the workers rather than international elite organisations then maybe this would have happened. You only have yourself to blame. Stew in it.

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  2. splinteredsunrise Avatar
    splinteredsunrise

    Italy is pretty depressing of late. One the most revealing things I think is the fascists promising to keep Berlusconi honest. It’s a bit like the UDA running for Stormont on a platform of keeping Paisley honest. Oh, hold on…

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  3. Hermes Avatar
    Hermes

    Why is it depressing? Why do your sympathies go out to the Gypsy or black man and not the Italian working man or small business man. I thought the Left was supposed to represent this constituency?

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  4. Liam Avatar
    Liam

    I think I can speak for Splintered on this one

    It’s depressing because the Italian working class has been one of the best organised and most militant in Europe. The political parties leading it moved rightwards very quickly in an attempt to push through a series of neo-liberal attacks on the working class and they have been rewarded with electoral annihilation.

    In Europe it is relatively unusual for a party in government to be so aggressively racist and use such violent language. The violent language always ends up with physical attacks on random people with darker skins and foreign accents. It also allows bourgeois parties to point at the immigrants and hold them responsible for capitalism’s inability to meet people’s needs.

    Oh and Berlusconi is a crook who is personally responsible for the worst TV in an advanced country.

    That’s pretty depressing isn’t it?

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  5. redbedhead Avatar
    redbedhead

    Hermes wrote: “Why do your sympathies go out to the Gypsy or black man and not the Italian working man or small business man. ”

    Besides the fact that your racism is shameful, you might be interested to know that many blacks and Gypsies are, in fact, Italian. Just like the Italian Jews during World War II that were persecuted. And just like, here in Canada, many millions of Italians are, in fact, Canadians.

    Brushing aside all that, what is the sense on the ground post-election? What is Rifondazione sayings? Is this likely to strengthen the left or the right in the party?

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  6. Hermes Avatar
    Hermes

    Judging by the comments above I forsee further annihilation of New Left orientated parties. A complete misunderstanding of the situation.

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  7. redbedhead Avatar
    redbedhead

    Hermes – Rifondazione did well when there was a big anti-capitalist movement in Italy, around Genoa, etc. It included a sizable anti-racist, pro-immigrant component.
    Rifondazione did poorly when that movement declined and they oriented instead upon Prodi’s centre-left coalition and voted for neo-liberal attacks and war in Afghanistan.
    It seems pretty clear to me.

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  8. entdinglichung Avatar
    entdinglichung

    see also http://www.16beavergroup.org/mtarchive/archives/000944.php … an interview with Sergio Bologna

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  9. Hermes Avatar
    Hermes

    No, throughout Europe there have been gradual changes. In Greece, a right wing party was voted into parliament mainly by disaffected right wing and left wing voters in traditionally left wing electorates. The working class (if there still is one) is disaffected with people like you who are more bourgoise than the ones you seek to overthrow.

    Ultimately, I believe the liberation movement will come from the Left as they always have. Or a Right which is more revolutionary in its proclaimations of democracy.

    Also, why is the word racist being mentioned. Who said anything vaguely racist? Please try and have dialogue to avoid problems in the future.

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  10. redbedhead Avatar
    redbedhead

    Hermes – First off, you’re better to not guess at people’s social class as the basis for your argument. As it happens I was born stinking poor and I remain poor. But thanks for elevating me to the top of the ladder. I’ll be sure and invite you onto my yacht.

    Secondly, the pattern in Europe is a lot more contradictory than you suggest. In Greece, PASOK was turfed after moving rightwards and implementing neo-liberal reforms. The Greek Tories replaced them as the only viable alternative electoral party but they have been getting a rough ride from the working class. And while PASOK hasn’t been able to benefit from that discontent, the far left vote has grown. In Germany the SPD was also punished electorally for its shift to the right and besides the usual shift to the Tory CDU in government, there has been an explosive growth for the left of Labour viz the Left Party. In Spain the Socialists won re-election, primarily because of their progressive stands on a number of key issues, including immigration, women’s rights, gay rights, ethnic minorities inside Spain (eg. Catalans, Basques, etc.). I could go on but you get my point.

    I’m using the word racist because you asked “why do your sympathies go out to the Gypsy or the black man” as though a) they aren’t also Italian and b) that they somehow deserve less sympathy than “Italian working man” (I note that you don’t mention the Italian working woman). You might notice that in Italy and elsewhere the levels of poverty amongst visible minorities (black people, asians, Gypsies, etc.) tends to be higher because of job discrimination, etc. They also face cultural oppression by the state (see Northern League propaganda in the post above) and by individuals such as yourself. That’s why your attitude is racist.

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  11. Hermes Avatar
    Hermes

    redbedhead, firstly, I meant ourgoise as in social values and outlook. Not economic standing. There is no way I can work out if you are sitting in a shack or a mansion over the Internet but I can guess at your values by the content and delivery of your writing.

    Secondly, regarding Greece I was referring to the election of LAOS. Not PASOK nor Nea Dimokratia. Check out the political scene in Poland, Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria and so on.

    Finally, the black man in Italy is not as Italian as the Italian man (man used to represent both man and woman). This point of contention is based on our conception of national identity. I guess you take a very legalistic viewpoint i.e. one only has to live there for a while and maybe be naturalised, whilst I believe national identity is that and much more. Also, minorities should face cultural repression by the State because they are not the of the dominant culture. I do not think Italy has pronounced itself a multicultural state so there is still a dominant culture.

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  12. Liam Avatar
    Liam

    “minorities should face cultural repression by the State because they are not the of the dominant culture”

    Hermes – if you want to find an outlet for that sort of racist tripe I suggest you go elsewhere. It’s not welcome here.

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  13. Hermes Avatar
    Hermes

    “Cultural repression” can mean many things to different people. I use the word broadly to mean an expectation for minorities, over the course of time, to adopt to the cultural, linguistic, religious and social customs of the dominant culture. You cannot enter someone’s house and not adopt to their rules. To do otherwise is rude. They should be given incentives to adopt. And if after a certain amount of time they do not adopt then they should be penalised by limiting their access to important government positions, universities, welfare payments and so on. This is a just solution to all the parties concerned.

    You may understand cultural repression as beatings, harrassment etc. I believe this is unacceptable and contrary to civilised values.

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  14. redbedhead Avatar
    redbedhead

    Hermes – I hate to tell you this but Italy is a mongrel culture – just like every other in Europe. Perhaps you’ve heard of the Roman empire, which drew to Italy millions of slaves, traders and the like from other cultural groups and kingdoms. Those people fundamentally re-shaped “Italian” culture (maybe you’ve heard of this crazy Jewish sect, called Christians?) Never mind that most of ancient Rome’s culture, philosophy, religion and politics was directly lifted from Greece. Where do you think pasta comes from? Not Italy. How about the use of wheat – not Italy. Never mind that Italy didn’t even exist until the end of the 19th century – there was no such thing as an “Italian”. And the Northern League shows that the small-minded regionalist bigotry still exists, since they don’t think southern Italians are real Italians. So, tell me, who precisely is this mythical Italian to which all others must accommodate? You?

    As for my being bourgeois in social values and outlook, maybe you could explain exactly what that means, because it sounds like a crock of shit to me. If you’re going to insult me, at least try to use something that has some content to it, rather than farting and calling it an opera.

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  15. Hermes Avatar
    Hermes

    Please spare me the history lesson (by the way there are some factual errors in your summary).

    All cultures accrete foreign influences over time. This is one of the most exhilarating reasons to read cultural history. However, it is undeniable that the culture of Gambia is different from the culture of an Italian living in Puglia, Fruili or Sardinia. There are more similaries between Puglia or Trieste than there are between Umbria compared to Gambia. Also, there is no myth. Despite globalisation Italian culture remains distinctive. Just as there is no mythical Cuban culture or Venezuelan culture. Or are they allowed to have a distinct culture and Europeans are not because some of them subscribe to the Trotskyist dream?

    Your social values and outlook remind me of my undergraduate days at university. However, go to your local pub and ask the boys about Gypsies and other repressed minorities. I think you will quickly find out your values do not really converge.

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  16. redbedhead Avatar
    redbedhead

    Well, Hermes since we’re both university grads you’re not really in a position to lob bourgeois insults – if there is any position to do so, like education is a bad thing. But, in any case, since I’ve worked in bars for going on 20 years, I probably have a pretty good idea about what people are saying in the pubs, thanks. Or, I could talk to my family of factory and postal workers. But thanks for giving me directions to the heartbeat of the nation.

    You misunderstand – of course there are regional differences (including significant linguistic differences) in Italy. It is an imaginary nation. There is more in common between a northern Italian and a Swiss than there is with a Sicilian. This is something that is different than with Cuba where the entire indigenous population was wiped out and supplanted by a Castillian dominated culture. Of course, there were then strong African influences because of slavery but Cuba is also a tiny island nation of 15 million or so people. There’s not a lot of space for the development of distinct linguistic and cultural groups – and certainly not in the space of a few hundred years. Venezuela is different again because of the influence and importance of the indigenous population, mostly excluded from power and influence, plus European colonists and African slaves.

    But, in any case, Europeans and their “distinct culture” is mostly a load of horseshit because the whole premise of it is xenophobic. It’s built on the idea that Europe, a primitive backwater until a few hundred years ago, generated its own culture in isolation from the other cultures of the world. Besides being a historical lie, it’s used for racist purposes (like your own) to justify exclusion of “foreigners” because they will dilute or pollute the pure national culture. The truth is that Europe has been strongly influence by China, the Middle East, Africa, etc. – from language through to technology and food. I gave Christianity as only the most obvious example of a major cultural institution whose origins are definitely not European.

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  17. Ray Avatar
    Ray

    Hermes you arguement is racist. No amount of justification on your part changes this. The logic of your arguement resulted in the Nazi’s and Auschwitz so I’d drop it if you really want to build a left in Italy, Greece or anywhere else for that matter.

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  18. Hermes Avatar
    Hermes

    oh the usual New Left racist clap trap about the European nation states. “Everything about Europe is a historical lie and everything about oppressed minorities and second and third world peoples is a Truth (of course someone has to bring in Nazis and Auschwitz to completely stifle debate – an old trick that has lost its effectiveness)”. Does anybody see how philosophically unsound this position is?

    Have you read Cornelius Castoriadis and his writings on the Greek and Renaissance Europe open systems as opposed to all other closed systems of thought? E.g. how many ancient Chinese and Indian books have you read where they seek to understand other cultures and actually give them praise like Herodotus? None. Only Europeans have sought to learn from others. Yes, they have been known to partake in some excesses but so have others. Finally, despite your hatred of all things European, all your forms of argumentation, logic, concepts, theories are drawn from European thinkers. Why don’t you draw your arguments from African philosophy? Guess what, there is none.

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  19. Ray Avatar
    Ray

    Hermes we don’t need to read a book to see where your arguement leads. You are using the same rhetoric as the Nazi’s who gassed jews and gypsies.

    You can dress it up in pseudo intellectual claptrap but it’s still the same old reactionary racism. It’s frankly shameful that you consider yourself to be of the left and even more disgusting that you peddle this racist nonsense as a way forward for the left. You are wasting your time trying to recruit us to your racist dogma.

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  20. redbedhead Avatar
    redbedhead

    Um, have you ever heard of St. Augustine? He was an African, from Algeria. But further more, your argument is absurd for a number of reasons:
    1) the Greeks, the Romans, the Babylonians (who shaped western thought in very important ways, including judeo-christianity) never considered themselves “European”. It is only modern Europe which claims Greece, et al, as part of Europe. In the time of classical Greek philosophers, Europe was completely uncivilized and the axis of cultural influence was the near east, Africa (particularly Egypt but also others) and eastward through the Persian empire and as far as China (the world’s oldest continuous civilization).
    2) the ways that philosophers get chosen is not simply a matter of who has the “best” clearest ideas. The Muslim empire had thinkers of much greater quality than most Europeans, who were mired in the post-Roman dark ages as the Muslim empire expanded, including expanding the sciences (for instance the basis of modern mathematics and medicine come from the Muslims). Galileo got a good taste of advanced European thinking.
    3) As to “open” societies – I seem to recall that it was Europe that invaded the Middle East (and were repelled by Saladin) to secure control of the holy land and slaughter all non-believers. It was Europe that enslaved Africans, installed brutal colonies wherever they landed and waged the two worst wars in human history in terms of geographical scope and lives lost (though, full points to the Japanese as well).

    And, if you want to win an argument, the best place to start is by engaging the arguments actually being put forward by your opponent instead of relying on ridiculous straw men or pathetic schoolyard name-calling. Nobody has said that everything about Europe is a lie or that everything about oppressed minorities and the developing world is a truth.
    Here’s what I wrote: “But, in any case, Europeans and their “distinct culture” is mostly a load of horseshit because the whole premise of it is xenophobic. It’s built on the idea that Europe, a primitive backwater until a few hundred years ago, generated its own culture in isolation from the other cultures of the world.”
    In other words, the argument is not that Europe has produced nothing of value, nor any innovations. The argument is that notions of national/cultural purity are demonstrably stupid and baseless since Europe – especially in the border countries like Italy – is a product of outside forces as much as internal developments. It’s just racist garbage used to tie people to the phoney boundaries that define “their country”, rather than feeling sympathy/solidarity with people who share the same basic conditions and interests but who speak another language, have different colour skins, or pray in a different manner. Instead of fighting their bosses or the state that is cutting services and breaking strikes, etc. they fight the easier target of their neighbour.

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  21. Ray Avatar
    Ray

    As for European culture where do you think anti-racism comes from? It was a movement started in Europe and the US against the disgusting treatment by racists towards blacks and gypsies. The left has a long tradition of fighting racists and will continue to do so. You cannot support your racist arguement by cherry picking European history. If you knew anything about European history then you wouldn’t make such ignorant statements.

    Europeans, blacks and gypsies fought against and defeated the Nazi’s. The left in Europe has continued to oppose racism. There is a proud tradition in Greece going back to before the resistance of fighting against the racist right. I suggest you learn from that tradition and drop your reactionary racist nonsense.

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  22. Hermes Avatar
    Hermes

    St Augustine was of Berber extraction but he wrote in a wholly Greco-Roman tradition with some Hebraic intrusions. We are talking about thought not ethnic origin. For example, Salman Rushdie is from the sub-continent but he writes mostly in a European tradition. Also, when we use the word Africa we use it a cultural sense not geographic. For example, north African Arabs and Berbers consider themselves part of the Arabic tradition not the African. Today, there are very few people that do anything that is not in a European tradition (including its capacity to subsume other cultural elements within its own).

    As for invasions, I think it was the rampant Islamic religion which spread itself from Arabia all the way to Spain and later into the Balkans. The small number of Christians left in the Middle East is testament to the liberal open minded Islamic world.

    I do not deal with your argument because it is itself horseshit. Who made any claim that Europe was a distinct culture closed off from the rest of the world? Who made any claims to purity? These a figments of your imagination (read back all the post to test this empirically), projecting your prior arguments with racists, onto me.

    We cannot say whether racism was started in Europe nor anywhere else. Probably all tribes thought the other tribe was inferior in some way. For example, the early Hebrews would refuse to eat at the same table as a Greek or Roman because they did not follow the Law. The Greeks and Romans were outraged at this because they almost always interested in learning how others lived.

    I would contend that the resistance against some of the excesses of capitalism and the State is more effective within a homogenous ethnic grouping.

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  23. Liam Avatar
    Liam

    Hermes this really is not the site for you. Redbedhead, Ray and I have been disagreeing sharply with each other for months on a lot of things there are certain assuumptions and theoretical ideas that we share.

    One of these is that phrases like “rampant Islamic religion” is racist and Islamophobic. Religion is a phenomomen that can be critically analysed (that’s one of the reasons I edited Kautsky’s book on early Christianity) but if you want to replace analysis of a specific thing in a specific time with racist demagoguery I will ban you from the site.

    As for the rise of Islamism in the last 20-30 years this is something that the left has examined in some detail.

    Here is a link to a video of an Iranian Marxist discussing the Iranian revolution and counter revolution.

    http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-4280949622005919590

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  24. Ray Avatar
    Ray

    “Salman Rushdie is from the sub-continent but he writes mostly in a European tradition.”

    What are you talking about? You make blanket statements without any analysis to back it up. Contemporary writers across the world have more in common with each other than Shakespear and Martin Amis ever have. The idea that art or literature is divided by races or culture is absolute rubbish. Are you going to claim Picasso as your own when he copied masks from Africa? There is no homogenous ethnic grouping and to claim that there is is racist and is the ideology that helps the ruling class divide workers and make us weaker.

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  25. Pietro Avatar
    Pietro

    Hermes, don’t worry, the humanity is divided into two parts. The one of man who think by themselves and have a critical spirit and well understanding, and the other one who, as Christ said, enjoy listening to other people talking about pleasant fatuous things (philosophy). You don’t belong to the second. Your intelligence carryed out you to be a prophet in what you wrote in 2008 about politic and northern italy, and now the left with its paranoic thoughts has been annihilated. Don’t loose your time with them. They neither understand to be racist and without love for the honest men going confusing love for personal rights with racism. In italy we say that they measure with their own meter. About nazism and fascism they both came from socialism and they all are generated by the sionistic massonery that always produce contrappositions to which the entire humanity runs. For this reasons the Lega Nord, being at the moment out of this perversous game, is hated and the “politically correct” try to stop. Have a nice day. Pietro

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